Home
Top.Mail.Ru Yandeks.Metrika
Forum: "Grab";
Current archive: 2002.01.08;
Download: [xml.tar.bz2];

Down

Competitions programs - SEA FIGHTING Find similar branches


Дремучий   (2001-10-26 13:55) [0]

who agrees ?

1) game type - strategy
2) classical rules with additions (ships can move, submarines, aircraft, etc.)
Additions to the rules will be taken from the project participants.
(and not only from them)
3) client server technology
a) game server
monitors the rules-interpretation of moves, controls the moves
graphics and sound
b) players (algorithms) -clients
written translator built-in language with the decryption function
algorithm (responsible for exe on the organizers)
c) data container for exchange
d) availability of a built-in language for working with a container

*) server - open source - is written together - source is open
client - translator - open source - is written together - source is open,
The client's algorithm is developed personally by everyone, encrypted

4) writing the function of encryption-decryption algorithm?
it should be in the transmitter, and the translator should be open source ...
What is a public key encryption thread? or how?

the main task of 4)! so as not to give out “enemies” algorithms.


if there are only a few who wish, the project perhapswill continue life on
my page ...
;))

Well ?
Who will be interested in the project?
we vote ... only those who are "for".



SergeyVP   (2001-10-29 07:54) [1]

I like the idea.
Only in more detail, please about item 3.b and about the container.



Дремучий   (2001-10-29 10:40) [2]


With the container, you can be wise.
the most beautiful to create
3) game COM server

the simplest is when the container is an ordinary file,
which (content) is scanned by timer, for example, every 5 seconds.
You can for example start with this option.


3b) players (algorithms) -clients
algorithms are written for example in this format

// read data from container
// executed before the next move outside the algorithm
// in the translator
ReadContainer;

the algorithm itself
// program scans the map
ScanMap;
....
// first ship analyzes cell
if OwnShip [1] .View (MapCell [i, j]) = moAlienShip
then begin
// turn the second ship to the right
OwnShip [2] .Move (mvRight);
// triple ship sails on one square
OwnShip [2] .Move (mvMove);
// triple ship shoots at enemy ship
OwnShip [2] .Fire (MapCell [i, j]);
end
// triple ship sails on one square
// in the old direction
else OwnShip [2] .Move (mvMove);
....

depending on the conditions in the container will fall

OwnShip [2] .Move (mvRight);
OwnShip [2] .Move (mvMove);
OwnShip [2] .Fire (MapCell [i, j]);

eight
OwnShip [2] .Move (mvMove);


for such an algorithm is written its own translator of this language

and the function of the de / encryption algorithm is needed so that your algorithm
could be set up without source for competition with others
algorithms
it should be in the transmitter, and the translator should be open source ...
problem ...
at least you can first implement all the previous ones,
and then hands will reach it.

;))




Дремучий   (2001-10-29 16:46) [3]


2 all
first developments can be found here.
http://www.sopilko.boom.ru/seafight/index.htm

Comrades, we actively connect ...
write me a soap
;))


2 Merlin
wishing so far is not enough, therefore, opened the section
on your site ...



Китаец Хо Ро Шо   (2001-10-30 12:10) [4]

Well, as with the game then?
somebody at least something thread will write?
or rummaged and enough. ;)

2 Dense,
you can count on me.
At least I will throw little ideas.



McSimm   (2001-10-30 12:44) [5]

2Number
It seems to me that with encryption nothing happens. Simple logic. If the program transmitting the code decrypts it, no one will be able to prevent this code from being seen in any way. There are several options. Sources come only to the organizers who honestly do not watch them. In this case, it makes no sense to encrypt them. Another option is that the text is compiled into pseudo-code in such a way that reverse decompilation is very difficult. This is practically not feasible in the presence of each source code. Or it’s just an option with a DLL.

2 Chinese Priest
And there are no ideas on the safety of using DLL?
(http://delphi.mastak.ru/cgi-bin/forum.pl?look=1&id=1003834600&n=3 branch)



Дремучий   (2001-10-30 21:44) [6]

2 McSimm
The problem is two-digit -
hide algorithm - a hole in security
good security - hard to hide the algorithm

of two evils choose the lesser. ;))
and then we'll see.
there is an idea - I will live a little, if everything goes well - I will lay out.

To analyze dll or ehe - I consider as business almost unreal,
and the one who does it - is undeniably cool.
in this area is not particularly strong, therefore, I am delirious with my path.
if anything, connect.
;))



McSimm   (2001-10-31 10:53) [7]

I will connect with pleasure as soon as I see a niche for myself. And over time, it will be simpler (abbreviation is now regular). For example, I can help in graphics - both in programming and creating sprites (ships, etc.)

Here is another point. With program competitions, time is measured in very small quantities. This is one of the reasons why I like the protocol system more than the real time. Those. 2 programs: the actual ground (no graphics, only functionality) and the player to view the match up and down. Consider whether it is worthwhile to drive the game into real-time and create any delays, etc., if it is still desirable to realize the opportunity to lose the match for analysis.



Wetnose   (2001-10-31 13:55) [8]

There is a suggestion:

The low-level interpreter understands a limited meager set of commands (analogue Assembler). The translator translates the instructions of the main high-level language into interpreter commands that are difficult to read. Thus, it is possible to solve the problem of hiding sources. I do not think that someone will decrypt them.



Wetnose   (2001-10-31 13:57) [9]

To Dormant
The link does not work



McSimm   (2001-10-31 14:21) [10]

2Wetnose.
This sentence has already sounded (see above - pseudocode). However, with a small set of commands and with the source texts of the translator and interpreter (even one of them), the task of decompiling is simply primitive.



Дремучий   (2001-10-31 15:46) [11]

2 Wetnose
>> Link not working
Wait, I can, the case of letters is not the same

2 McSimm
of course you are right.
and I agreed with that from the very beginning.

without trust is not enough.
the easiest way out is
written several dll de / pseudocode encryption -
but the most interesting is that they are written by several people.
if these people can be trusted - the encryption problem is solved.

One causes another, second third ...
for both encryption and decryption of pseudocode

The author encrypts the algorithm with such a system.
in theory, without knowing the algorithm of one of the dll -
can not decrypt


the problem turns out to be that to perform -
the translator needs the decoded code.


This means that if you add a drop to the code of the transmitter
decrypted algorithm where-thread to disk ... then all encryption to p ...

encryption dll output - must be certified with respect to the translator code - i.e. if the translator's COP is different from the specified one, then
no decryption occurs. There should be several such checks (directly in the dll) in different places to make it harder to break.

as a result
translator - open source
ugo can compile everyone on his machine.
dll are written by people you can trust.
dll stitched checks for the reliability of the translator

everything seems beautiful ...
It was not there - you can run the switch under the debugger.

How can I get around such a trick?
Any ideas?




Tosov   (2001-10-31 22:05) [12]

And the translator is what ???



panov   (2001-10-31 22:17) [13]

What are you all about protection?

Give you the source code to the organizer, and that’s the end of it.

All right, so keep your code.
Well, it would be something like "GameSoft MustDie" with the possibility of endless sucking money. And then just an algorithm.
Even if he leaves - will you lose much?



Tosov   (2001-10-31 22:39) [14]

2 panov
so all at once fled and gave the source. Do not wait !! :)



Дремучий   (2001-10-31 23:08) [15]

2 Tosov © (31.10.01 22: 05)
>> And the translator is what ???
in my understanding, the same as the interpreter is a program that performs
code written in any language (or its pseudocode) without compilation i. direct translation into machine codes.

2 panov
and protection is a necessary thing, but first you need to have something to protect ...
because no one forces its algorithm to encrypt, it is voluntary.
but without hiding the algorithm, sporting interest is lost.

;))




Tosov   (2001-10-31 23:51) [16]

2 Dense
in my understanding, the same as the interpreter is a program that performs
code written in any language (or its pseudocode) without compilation i. direct translation into machine codes.

In my opinion too .. and how to use it in this situation - so that the sources are not nebylo and the computers are not spoiled and while writing on Delphi?




Дремучий   (2001-11-01 00:13) [17]

2Tosov ©
on Delphi is written all except client algorithms
the project is open to everyone;))

writing algorithms for the interpreter -
The second part of Marlezonsky ballet.
even without this feature (algorithm protection),
The challenge is quite fascinating.

about the protection so as not to repeat ....
see Deep © (31.10.01 15: 46)
the words
2 McSimm
of course you are right.
and I agreed with that from the very beginning ...






Tosov   (2001-11-01 00:57) [18]

2Drampy ©
> everything is written on Delphi except client algorithms - is it that controls the moves ?? If so, then what is left to write ??

> the project is open to everyone;))
The client for the forum was also written by everyone :)) They wrote ...

You can once again in more detail how everything will look. Everything was clear early - the participant writes Dll, etc.





Дремучий   (2001-11-01 01:33) [19]

2 Tosov
if the interpreter language is maximally similar to Pascal -
then client algorithms - it turns out to be written also on Delphi.

>> The client for the forum also wrote everything :)) They wrote ...
Sir Alex is just the source of the event to lay out ...
let's see, the thing is also not easy

>> You can once again in more detail how everything will look. Everything is clear
>> it was - the participant writes Dll, etc.
again
writing algorithms for the interpreter -
The second part of Marlezonsky ballet.

first let's write just a toy.
and then you can wind up - translators, algorithms ...
really not interesting as is a toy born?

what will the toy look like?
the rules themselves and think up and programmed.
developments can be found here.
http://www.sopilko.boom.ru/seafight/index.htm




Tosov   (2001-11-01 18:51) [20]

2 Deep ©
if the interpreter language is maximally similar to Pascal -
then client algorithms - it turns out are written too on Delfi.

Or maybe we'll write FreeDelphi :)) —this is rather unrealistic or there will be a minimum of functions, and then Help will write, we will write a similarity to MSDN and write the book “Sea Battle for Downs” ...

writing algorithms for interpreter
first let's just write a toy
There, on the site, write terminology - what is the interpreter, the translator ... in this case? interpreter - it looks like it is the most important part of the program, and you have it cut off from the toy
As I understand it - it is written in a self-made language and then what .. compiles (security problems), source files are sent? It is also desirable to explain the site ..



Дремучий   (2001-11-01 20:37) [21]

2Tosov © (01.11.01 18: 51)
>> Or maybe we'll write FreeDelphi :)) is rather unreal or will be
>> minimum of functions ...
1)
in the interpreter it is enough that it is the most necessary (that is, the minimum of functions), the rest is optional ...
if you consider such tuls in programming to be useless (like for downs), then this project is not for you ...
2)
Are you interested in the whole project or just writing algorithms?

3)
>> It is also desirable to explain the site ..
1) project just started, not all right away
2) how it will be equally dependent on you
>> compiles (security issues) ...
3) for the last reasons, the algorithm is de / encrypted by certified dll, but there is a problem with the debugger ... (see above)



Tosov   (2001-11-01 22:22) [22]

(type for downs)
1. Please do not alter my words. I wanted to know what the new language will be: Standard Pascal functions or HrenPoiMeChto views (KORABL @ oid ^, MMM $$ koj $): KDKF; for which you need help.

2. Generally.
3. A screenshot of the game is already ready, but there is no description of it. Do something like http://delphi.mastak.ru/klient.txt "see. How I see it"



Tosov   (2001-11-01 22:23) [23]

2 Deep ©
(type for downs)
1. Please do not alter my words. I wanted to know what the new language will be: Standard Pascal functions or HrenPoiMeChto views (KORABL @ oid ^, MMM $$ koj $): KDKF; for which you need help.

2. Generally.
3. A screenshot of the game is already ready, but there is no description of it. Do something like http://delphi.mastak.ru/klient.txt "see. How I see it"



Дремучий   (2001-11-01 23:44) [24]

2 Tosov ©
>> 2 Dense ©
>>(type for downs)

I may be offended, citizen Tosov ...
however, I do not promise cruel revenge.
;)

>> 3. A screenshot of the game is already ready, but there is no description of it. Do something like >> "see. How I see it"
Soon it will be, but you seem, have not realized that it is
Open Source Projectwhich is created collectively ...
>> "see. How we see it."







Tosov   (2001-11-02 01:30) [25]

Dense ©
This is -> (like for downs) <- There was a quote that does not apply to anyone personally.

>> "see. How I see it" - And this was the name of the section of the text

Soon it will be, but you seem, have not realized that it is
Open Source Project, which is created collectively ...
And IMHO better "How я(i.e., you) see it "because" one must see (in the sense of not all) a person, otherwise it will be like in the fable about the swan, cancer and pike => we will not go far.
Shl. See, considering the opinions of others ...



Дремучий   (2001-11-02 16:26) [26]

2 Tosov © (02.11.01 01: 30)
>> Open Source Project - See, considering the opinions of others ...
Agree to 100%, at least in the initial stages

found a cool picture
added screen saver / about
;) And How?



Tosov   (2001-11-03 00:55) [27]

The picture is normal .. The interface is there, there are no internals of the program: (description too



Pages: 1 whole branch

Forum: "Grab";
Current archive: 2002.01.08;
Download: [xml.tar.bz2];

Top









Memory: 0.95 MB
Time: 0.045 c
1-22016
Leviathan
2001-12-13 23:05
2002.01.08
Appearance form


1-22160
Yakudza
2001-12-20 16:46
2002.01.08
Copy to Clipboard


4-22489
Skiv
2001-11-05 09:55
2002.01.08
Display version * .exe


3-21940
Serik
2001-12-05 09:15
2002.01.08
InterBase & VisualC ++


3-21966
Z.G.
2001-12-03 12:42
2002.01.08
WHY THAT DID ALL MY QUESTIONS. We'll have to repeat How to search the Type in the field: Ceilings are written and I need to find





afrikaans albanian Arabic armenian azerbaijani basque belarusian bulgarian catalan Chinese (Simplified) Chinese (Traditional) croatian Czech danish Dutch English estonian filipino finnish French
galician georgian German greek haitian Creole hebrew Hindi hungarian icelandic indonesian Irish italian japanese Korean latvian lithuanian macedonian malay maltese norwegian
persian polish portuguese Romanian russian serbian slovak Slovenian Español swahili Swedish thai turkish Ukrainian urdu vietnamese welsh yiddish bengali bosnian
cebuano Esperanto gujarati hausa hmong igbo javanese kannada khmer lao latin maori marathi mongolian nepali punjabi somali tamil telugu yoruba
zulu
English French German Italian Portuguese Russian Spanish